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RE: swing thoughts are killing my game - 06/12/12 10:15:56 AM
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kcee
Posts: 10,000+
Joined: 12/31/02
From: CT
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Release
I was told long time ago by my first instructor "Don the Magician Mandrake ", think of nothing but scoring on the golf course.
Think scoring means course management , means how to play the shot in front of you to the best ability you could that day.
No swing thoughts on the golf course, but if you must, have only one or two simple key swing thoughts. Like to finish the follow through, like to take the club back to parellel... but you should be only concentrate on scoring alone.
I was told that as well. Figure things out like whether you are going for the pin or middle of the green, best place(s) to miss, wind, etc and then decide on the shot, but there really shouldn't be any thinking after that. You've committed to what you want to do, you do it and then accept the results no matter what.
Getting ball bound is a horrible thing. I was stuck on that a few years back and the pro proved it was all in my head. I couldn't hit an iron to save my life, but he had me grab a 5i (my hardest to hit iron) and he rolled balls to me to hit. I flushed at least 75% of them with a nice high draw. Next he lined up a bunch of balls and had me walk up and "Happy Gilmore" them one after the other. Hardly a bad shot. I try to remember that every time I play now.
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RE: swing thoughts are killing my game - 06/12/12 10:46:54 AM
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jreed3
Posts: 3960
Joined: 05/16/07
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: stroh
Just to clarify.
jreed,
I wasn't implying that you need a perfect lie to play good golf. If you are hitting a 7 iron: 180 to 5 feet, let alone just on the green you're an accomplished player and your mechanics are fine. You're not bothered with trying to help the ball or afraid to hit down through it, or any of that garbage.
I was simply speaking to more of a psychological phenomena of not having control. The ball is yours, it's in play. You must address it, stand over it and can easily become too focused on it.
When that happens your focus moves to hitting the ball as opposed to advancing it to your target. That's where you start having swing thoughts. I have to come from the inside, I have to release, I have to focus on hitting the inside quarter of the ball, etc.
So, yeah, you are being bothered by swing thoughts, but it comes from being ball bound.
"Free up" a couple of those lies in a practice round to a "perfect lie", and I bet you get back on track.
Hardly an accomplished player, lol. It was a huge elevation drop so that took away a lot of the distance. I did stick both shots close though. Mechanic wise I think my swing is sound. In fact the guy that I played with this weekend commented as I was taking my practice swings before teeing off that I must be playing alot as my swing looks really nice. Of course, I dont play alot...usually only once every 2 or 3 weeks.
I get what you are saying; it's a really interesting idea and I can see where that is true for me. Im going to start doing as you suggest; freeing up some balls to perfect lies and see what happens. Swinging through the ball is definitely an issue i can see.
I like the drill of the happy gilmore swing and hitting a rolling ball....ill give that a try.
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RE: swing thoughts are killing my game - 06/20/12 1:41:41 PM
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JamesBurg
Posts: 512
Joined: 12/25/05
Status: offline
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If swing thoughts are killing your game, then you are using the wrong swing thoughts.
I, and the guys I play with, have been using the same swing thoughts for 7 years now, and they have never failed us.
We got those thoughts from "The Golf Swing And Its Master Key Explained" by Noel Thomas. This is a gem in golf instruction, but it seems that it is still not well known.
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RE: swing thoughts are killing my game - 06/21/12 12:42:01 AM
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elvis56
Posts: 5166
Joined: 04/25/03
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Release
I was told long time ago by my first instructor "Don the Magician Mandrake ", think of nothing but scoring on the golf course.
Think scoring means course management , means how to play the shot in front of you to the best ability you could that day.
No swing thoughts on the golf course, but if you must, have only one or two simple key swing thoughts. Like to finish the follow through, like to take the club back to parellel... but you should be only concentrate on scoring alone.
I've never understood this. how can you not think at all before you swing? You've gotta have some conscious thought to get it started. I agree with your idea of one or two simple thoughts are best,but they're still thoughts. When I hear people say they have no thoughts on the course, I get very confused.
Not arguing with you,personally,it's just someting you hear alot that makes no sense to me.
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RE: swing thoughts are killing my game - 06/21/12 3:24:08 AM
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clubdoctoruk
Posts: 1086
Joined: 01/23/09
Status: offline
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If you want to walk from A to B, do you need a conscious 'walk thought' about how you do that before you take your first step?
If you consciously try to think about which foot you move first or the precise sequence of movements you need to make in order to walk from A to B, it will likely screw things up.
Muscle memory is the result of repetition - the more you repeat a move, the less you have to think about it. Tom Wishon's first clubfitting book opens with the following:
quote:
Real game improvement for any golfer can come in only two ways - taking lessons from a competent teaching professional and practicing the changes that are advised, or by acquiring a custom-fit set of golf clubs that employ changes in design to overcome poor swing movements and accentuate the proper motions the golfer makes in the swing.
PGA Master Professional Gary Wiren, considered to be one of the teachers and theoreticians of the golf swing in the world, has been quoted as saying that a major change to correct a swing error requires no less than 10,000 repetitions of the new movement before it can be considered a permanent part of the golfer's swing.
Such thinking assumes that the golfer .... will be able to to make the correct movement every time it is practiced. In golf, the statement "practice makes perfect" is not true. As Mr. Wiren also stated, "it is only perfect practice that makes perfect". Therefore, for each of the 10,000 required swings to work towards cementing the change, each one has to be correct, with no slipping back into the old, incorrect movement ...
So if you're essentially flailing around in the dark, trying different things all the time without any guidance WRT what things in your swing you SHOULD be trying to change and what you SHOULD be practicing, rather than five-minute quick fixes that change from week to week or even day to day, possibly using equipment that engenders bad set-up and swing habits, you will likely never get to the point that you can actually swing without having to think consciously about your swing ...
A good start for a lot of people would be to divert some of the money they spend on HOing equipment to lessons and practice (and ensuring that the equipment they do use actually fits them properly...)  
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RE: swing thoughts are killing my game - 07/06/12 5:12:15 AM
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jreed3
Posts: 3960
Joined: 05/16/07
Status: offline
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Just wanted to post an update on a little bit of my progress. While I was in Myrtle Beach last week I was fortunate enough to play a round. Everything went well and it was the best ball striking day I have ever had. While I shot a 90, I was pleased with my progress. This thread really helped me and I used a number of the tips such as practice swings behind the ball, not grounding the club until Im ready to go, and finding a tempo in my head. the issues I problems I had during the round were things that I typically excel at such as putting and driving. I missed multiple birdie putts including two putting from 5 feet on #1. Also, there were multiple occasions where I misjudged distances and my ball ended up in the water.
All in all though I am very pleased...thanks to all for the advice!
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RE: swing thoughts are killing my game - 07/06/12 6:50:42 AM
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PerfectImpact
Posts: 4059
Joined: 10/24/02
Status: offline
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There are TWO boxes you need to get into before you start your backswing.
(per Annika Sorenstam)
1) the thinking box, when you make all your decision: club, aim line, measuring to the ball (feet to ball, and chest to ground) to the best of your ability for getting sweet spot impact - you won't be searching for the ball during your swing..., and any final picture of how you're going to thrust the club thru the ball and the line on which you'll do that. Most of this is almost instantaneous: it doesn't mean you stand and ponder: you just decide stuff.
2) the doing box: at this point all thinking stops and you simply execute your swing; ITS thought needs to be your sense of thrust and the direction you make it. Of course you're not allowed to "move around or leave the area" before the ball has been struck, so finish the job of getting the ball on its way before looking up. Someone else will tell you where it went.
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George Hibbard
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and now that i've peaked my back won't let me swing a club. 
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